Photoshop How To Use: rec.photo.digital - 26 new messages in 2 topics

rec.photo.digital
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Today's topics:

* Scenic areas in England - 25 messages, 5 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.photo.digital/t/1076be556766c491?hl=en
* May I know where to find these programs? - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.photo.digital/t/db6cd71e48b688fe?hl=en

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Scenic areas in England
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.photo.digital/t/1076be556766c491?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 25 ==
Date: Mon, May 11 2009 12:09 am
From: Savageduck

On 2009-05-10 23:46:47 -0700, "Ian F." <wowfabgroovy@googlemail.com> said:

> "Savageduck" <savageduck1{REMOVESPAM}@me.com> wrote in message
> news:2009051015593927544-savageduck1REMOVESPAM@mecom...
>
>> ostrich feather clad dancers.
>
> When were you there? 1962?
>
> Ian

Hyperbolic jest!

My visits were in 1983 & 1994, and I have no desire to test the waters
now. I have other places on my list of travel destinations.
--
Regards,
Savageduck

== 2 of 25 ==
Date: Mon, May 11 2009 12:11 am
From: Savageduck

On 2009-05-11 00:03:47 -0700, Chris H <chris@phaedsys.org> said:

> In message <uane059nfql6v52lghc7ob2ob7kshet4vr@4ax.com>, tony cooper
> <tony_cooper213@earthlink.net> writes
>>>
>>> Well yes... I saw a program about the casinos in Las Vegas and the
>>> Americans were looking at the recreations of Venice and the Eiffel tower
>>> etc and saying it's all here we don't need to go to Europe... but I hope
>>> they are the exception
>>
>> Disneyland Europe, or whatever it is they call it, was built so
>> Europeans wouldn't need to bother coming to the US.
>
> Interestingly it has not been that much of a success, apparently. A
> lot of people do go but for some reason many like to go to Florida to
> see "the real thing" . No figures just some half remembered news items
> over the last few years.
>
> It has had a couple of re-branding and re-launches but I don't think it
> has the success that the US version had. Mind you siting it in France
> was possibly not the best idea.

France would only work if they installed a permanent Jerry Lewis ride. :-)

--
Regards,
Savageduck

== 3 of 25 ==
Date: Mon, May 11 2009 12:20 am
From: "Ian F."

"Savageduck" <savageduck1{REMOVESPAM}@me.com> wrote in message
news:2009051100091138165-savageduck1REMOVESPAM@mecom...

> My visits were in 1983 & 1994,

Ah, that explains it.

> and I have no desire to test the waters now. I have other places on my
> list of travel destinations.

Me too. I do Vegas *and* the other places!

Ian

== 4 of 25 ==
Date: Mon, May 11 2009 12:21 am
From: Chris H

In message <2009051100114984492-savageduck1REMOVESPAM@mecom>, Savageduck
<savageduck1{REMOVESPAM}@me.com> writes
>On 2009-05-11 00:03:47 -0700, Chris H <chris@phaedsys.org> said:
>
>> In message <uane059nfql6v52lghc7ob2ob7kshet4vr@4ax.com>, tony cooper
>> <tony_cooper213@earthlink.net> writes
>>>> Well yes... I saw a program about the casinos in Las Vegas and the
>>>> Americans were looking at the recreations of Venice and the Eiffel tower
>>>> etc and saying it's all here we don't need to go to Europe... but I hope
>>>> they are the exception
>>> Disneyland Europe, or whatever it is they call it, was built so
>>> Europeans wouldn't need to bother coming to the US.
>> Interestingly it has not been that much of a success, apparently.
>>A
>> lot of people do go but for some reason many like to go to Florida to
>> see "the real thing" . No figures just some half remembered news items
>> over the last few years.
>> It has had a couple of re-branding and re-launches but I don't think
>>it
>> has the success that the US version had. Mind you siting it in France
>> was possibly not the best idea.
>
>France would only work if they installed a permanent Jerry Lewis ride. :-)

Explain please you have lost me with that one.

--
\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\
\/\/\/\/\ Chris Hills Staffs England /\/\/\/\/
\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/

== 5 of 25 ==
Date: Mon, May 11 2009 12:33 am
From: Ron Hunter

tony cooper wrote:
> On Sun, 10 May 2009 08:55:57 +0200, Wolfgang Schwanke <see@sig.nature>
> wrote:
>
>> tony cooper <tony_cooper213@earthlink.net> wrote in
>> news:246b051d42a3u96iv9e1akou2mn6a3qbja@4ax.com:
>>
>>> My wife and I have traveled to Europe, Africa, Central America, South
>>> America, and some of the Caribbean islands. One of my wife's brothers
>>> never traveled outside of Illinois in his life. He was an
>>> intelligent, successful, interesting person. He simply had no
>>> interest in travel.
>>>
>>> There are many Europeans exactly like my wife's brother. There are
>>> other Europeans who travel extensively.
>> But do those Europeans pretend that they can experience the same things
>> at home?
>
> I don't see any American pretending he can experience the same things
> at home. The point made was that Americans can travel within the US
> borders and experience a wide diversity. They travel to experience
> what is different from their home locale, and travel within the US
> does allow that. They don't experience the same differences they'd
> see in Europe, but they can experience enough difference to satisfy
> their needs and wants.
>
>
When I travel, it is the differences that I enjoy. Sometimes, the lack
of much difference makes me more uncomfortable than greater differences.
For instance, going to Canada (B.C.) from Texas causes more discomfort
than going to Germany because the similarities lead to unexpected
surprises. One expects differences, and there are some, but not to the
level one would normally expect in another country. Of course, had that
been Quebec, I am sure there would have been much more difference.

== 6 of 25 ==
Date: Mon, May 11 2009 12:36 am
From: "Mike"

On Sun, 10 May 2009 08:23:32 -0400, "Stormin Mormon"
<cayoung61**spamblock##@hotmail.com> wrote:

>Unless you think that socialists who control
>every facet of society from the government are "sensible". I
>prefer freedom and liberty.

you have some odd ideas.
--
Mike

== 7 of 25 ==
Date: Mon, May 11 2009 12:37 am
From: Ron Hunter

Savageduck wrote:
> On 2009-05-10 11:07:28 -0700, tony cooper <tony_cooper213@earthlink.net> said:
>
>> On Sun, 10 May 2009 08:55:57 +0200, Wolfgang Schwanke <see@sig.nature>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> tony cooper <tony_cooper213@earthlink.net> wrote in
>>> news:246b051d42a3u96iv9e1akou2mn6a3qbja@4ax.com:
>>>
>>>> My wife and I have traveled to Europe, Africa, Central America, South
>>>> America, and some of the Caribbean islands. One of my wife's brothers
>>>> never traveled outside of Illinois in his life. He was an
>>>> intelligent, successful, interesting person. He simply had no
>>>> interest in travel.
>>>>
>>>> There are many Europeans exactly like my wife's brother. There are
>>>> other Europeans who travel extensively.
>>> But do those Europeans pretend that they can experience the same things
>>> at home?
>> I don't see any American pretending he can experience the same things
>> at home. The point made was that Americans can travel within the US
>> borders and experience a wide diversity. They travel to experience
>> what is different from their home locale, and travel within the US
>> does allow that. They don't experience the same differences they'd
>> see in Europe, but they can experience enough difference to satisfy
>> their needs and wants.
>>
>>
>
> Agreed.
>
> I live in wine country on the California Central Coast, it is a
> completly different World to the nightmare of L.A. and tourist
> Disneyland, which to me is totally avoidable. (I find myself to be "Big
> city" averse.)
> Having said that, from where I live it is a few hours drive into, or
> over the Sierras, North into Coastal Redwoods or over to Death Valley.
> I think of Hwy1 and Big Sur as "Local" and I never tire of it.
> Then there is Alaska, the North West including B.C. The Canadian
> Rockies and Vancouver which is one of the most culturally diverse
> cities anywhere. I have also lived in Upstate NY in Syracuse, Utica and
> a small place in the Adirondacks on the Fulton chain of lakes, Inlet. I
> always thought of NYC as an alien planet.
>
> '''but I have not limited myself, I started travelling young. I have
> travelled through Brazil, Uruguay and Argentina. I am well travelled in
> South Africa, Namibia, Botswana, Lesotho, Zambia & Zimbabwe.
> My Indian Ocean island experience wss 10 days on Mauritius (I have yet
> to see Hawaii.)
>
> I am very familiar with much of the UK beyond London, I find Cornwall,
> Devon & Wales much to my liking.
>
> As a refugee of the sixties my Oriental travels were limited to a
> meditation in green determined by a Selective Service # of 54.
> Then there are my limited European travels to the Netherlands and Switzerland.
>
> Now I am retired I have plans for some exploration in the neglected
> countries, which will include the usual suspects & Eastern Europe and
> one other area I have yet to see, Australia & New Zealand.
>
> ...and I will still not have done all I want to do and see in the US.

By all means, do see Hawaii. Very beautiful place. But takes lots of
money as it is a very 'touristy' place. If you can stay out of the
cities, you will meet some really nice people. DO try to learn a few
words of the native language, though, as they really appreciate the effort.

== 8 of 25 ==
Date: Mon, May 11 2009 12:38 am
From: "Mike"

On Sat, 09 May 2009 08:22:48 -0500, Ron Hunter <rphunter@charter.net>
wrote:

>and some of the changes are more
>noticeable than traveling between, say, Germany, Austria, and Switzerland.

try instead Cornwall. London, San Sebastien, Paris and Sevilla.
--
Mike

== 9 of 25 ==
Date: Mon, May 11 2009 12:40 am
From: Ron Hunter

tony cooper wrote:
> On Sun, 10 May 2009 13:46:15 -0700, Savageduck
> <savageduck1{REMOVESPAM}@me.com> wrote:
>
>> On 2009-05-10 11:07:28 -0700, tony cooper <tony_cooper213@earthlink.net> said:
>>
>>> On Sun, 10 May 2009 08:55:57 +0200, Wolfgang Schwanke <see@sig.nature>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> tony cooper <tony_cooper213@earthlink.net> wrote in
>>>> news:246b051d42a3u96iv9e1akou2mn6a3qbja@4ax.com:
>>>>
>>>>> My wife and I have traveled to Europe, Africa, Central America, South
>>>>> America, and some of the Caribbean islands. One of my wife's brothers
>>>>> never traveled outside of Illinois in his life. He was an
>>>>> intelligent, successful, interesting person. He simply had no
>>>>> interest in travel.
>>>>>
>>>>> There are many Europeans exactly like my wife's brother. There are
>>>>> other Europeans who travel extensively.
>>>> But do those Europeans pretend that they can experience the same things
>>>> at home?
>>> I don't see any American pretending he can experience the same things
>>> at home. The point made was that Americans can travel within the US
>>> borders and experience a wide diversity. They travel to experience
>>> what is different from their home locale, and travel within the US
>>> does allow that. They don't experience the same differences they'd
>>> see in Europe, but they can experience enough difference to satisfy
>>> their needs and wants.
>>>
>>>
>> Agreed.
>>
>> I live in wine country on the California Central Coast, it is a
>> completly different World to the nightmare of L.A. and tourist
>> Disneyland, which to me is totally avoidable. (I find myself to be "Big
>> city" averse.)
>> Having said that, from where I live it is a few hours drive into, or
>> over the Sierras, North into Coastal Redwoods or over to Death Valley.
>> I think of Hwy1 and Big Sur as "Local" and I never tire of it.
>> Then there is Alaska, the North West including B.C. The Canadian
>> Rockies and Vancouver which is one of the most culturally diverse
>> cities anywhere. I have also lived in Upstate NY in Syracuse, Utica and
>> a small place in the Adirondacks on the Fulton chain of lakes, Inlet. I
>> always thought of NYC as an alien planet.
>>
> The most interesting part of travel is being around things that are
> different from what you are around in your daily life. I'm going to
> the airport tomorrow to pick up my brother who is coming here from
> Europe for a visit. There will be hundreds of people there flooding
> into Orlando. I'll be there wishing I was on my way somewhere else.
>
> I want hills and real foliage. I want old barns to photograph. I
> want gritty urban street scenes to photograph. I want small towns
> with a real small-time atmosphere and a courthouse in the middle of
> the town square (or circle) with old codgers with character in their
> faces sitting on benches. I want abandoned factories and covered
> bridges. I want to sneak photographs of people at a county fair that
> has more than a midway.
>
> I like living in Florida most of the time, but I want a change of
> scenery some of the time. Never mind that culture stuff; I want
> something in front of the lens that's not a pelican, a strip mall, or
> just another stretch of beach.
>
>
You can find all that, except the covered bridges, in Texas. I would
recommend staying away from the coast as you would feel you were back in
Florida.

== 10 of 25 ==
Date: Mon, May 11 2009 12:41 am
From: "Mike"

On Sat, 09 May 2009 08:22:48 -0500, Ron Hunter <rphunter@charter.net>
wrote:

> I doubt it, or you would know that
>there are a LOT of things that change from one US state to the next, and
>the farther you travel, the more differences you find. Laws vary a LOT,
>as do language, culture, attitudes, and customary things like how
>traffic flows. About the only really consistent thing you will see in
>traveling through the US is the currency.

no national restaurant chains?
--
Mike

== 11 of 25 ==
Date: Mon, May 11 2009 12:43 am
From: "Mike"

On Sun, 10 May 2009 06:29:02 -0700, Savageduck
<savageduck1{REMOVESPAM}@me.com> wrote:

> It is not a one size fits all country

is anywhere?
--
Mike

== 12 of 25 ==
Date: Mon, May 11 2009 12:43 am
From: Ron Hunter

Chris H wrote:
> In message <5m4e05hidbh48eouvm8ldfetfhuho6ovre@4ax.com>, tony cooper
> <tony_cooper213@earthlink.net> writes
>> On Sun, 10 May 2009 08:55:57 +0200, Wolfgang Schwanke <see@sig.nature>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> tony cooper <tony_cooper213@earthlink.net> wrote in
>>> news:246b051d42a3u96iv9e1akou2mn6a3qbja@4ax.com:
>>>
>>>> My wife and I have traveled to Europe, Africa, Central America, South
>>>> America, and some of the Caribbean islands. One of my wife's brothers
>>>> never traveled outside of Illinois in his life. He was an
>>>> intelligent, successful, interesting person. He simply had no
>>>> interest in travel.
>>>>
>>>> There are many Europeans exactly like my wife's brother. There are
>>>> other Europeans who travel extensively.
>>> But do those Europeans pretend that they can experience the same things
>>> at home?
>> I don't see any American pretending he can experience the same things
>> at home.
>
> Well yes... I saw a program about the casinos in Las Vegas and the
> Americans were looking at the recreations of Venice and the Eiffel tower
> etc and saying it's all here we don't need to go to Europe... but I hope
> they are the exception
>
>
Grin. Las Vegas is an experience in itself, and quite unique. It's
well worth a long visit, but doesn't have the flavor of Europe in any
way. Were it not for the difficulty of getting there, I might go more
often. To compare things like the Luxor Hotel/Casino to the real
pyramids is rather like comparing the space shuttle to a clay airplane.

== 13 of 25 ==
Date: Mon, May 11 2009 12:45 am
From: Ron Hunter

Savageduck wrote:
> On 2009-05-10 14:32:08 -0700, Chris H <chris@phaedsys.org> said:
>
>> In message <5m4e05hidbh48eouvm8ldfetfhuho6ovre@4ax.com>, tony cooper
>> <tony_cooper213@earthlink.net> writes
>>> On Sun, 10 May 2009 08:55:57 +0200, Wolfgang Schwanke <see@sig.nature>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> tony cooper <tony_cooper213@earthlink.net> wrote in
>>>> news:246b051d42a3u96iv9e1akou2mn6a3qbja@4ax.com:
>>>>
>>>>> My wife and I have traveled to Europe, Africa, Central America, South
>>>>> America, and some of the Caribbean islands. One of my wife's brothers
>>>>> never traveled outside of Illinois in his life. He was an
>>>>> intelligent, successful, interesting person. He simply had no
>>>>> interest in travel.
>>>>>
>>>>> There are many Europeans exactly like my wife's brother. There are
>>>>> other Europeans who travel extensively.
>>>> But do those Europeans pretend that they can experience the same things
>>>> at home?
>>> I don't see any American pretending he can experience the same things
>>> at home.
>> Well yes... I saw a program about the casinos in Las Vegas and the
>> Americans were looking at the recreations of Venice and the Eiffel tower
>> etc and saying it's all here we don't need to go to Europe... but I hope
>> they are the exception
>
> Strangely enough there are Americans who do whatever they can to avoid
> Vegas (and DisneyLand), I am one of them. The pretentious artificiality
> of the place stinks! The Japanese and those from the Gulf States seem
> to like it. So much so we are going to have new & improved versions
> rise in the Arabian desert and places such as Dubai. The tourist
> industry will sell these destinations just as they sold Vegas.
>
> I have other plans.
>
I very much prefer rural areas, and 'real life' people, and simple
pleasures, like unpretentious good food, beautiful flowers, and open
spaces. My wife, however, likes cities, shopping malls, and nice
hotels... Maybe we should take separate vacations....

== 14 of 25 ==
Date: Mon, May 11 2009 12:47 am
From: Ron Hunter

Savageduck wrote:
> On 2009-05-10 15:12:43 -0700, "Ian F." <wowfabgroovy@googlemail.com> said:
>
>> "Savageduck" <savageduck1{REMOVESPAM}@me.com> wrote in message
>> news:2009051015050911272-savageduck1REMOVESPAM@mecom...
>>
>>> Strangely enough there are Americans who do whatever they can to avoid
>>> Vegas (and DisneyLand), I am one of them. The pretentious artificiality
>>> of the place stinks!
>> Sacrilege! How dare you, sir? You are speaking of the Vegas I love!
>>
>> Ian
>
> On my two visits to Vegas, one was the vacation type trip and it was
> just smoke-filled ugly.
> The only redeeming part of that trip was leaving Vegas and going to
> Zion NP, which is one of those truly "must see" places.
>
> The second was an opportunity to go to CES, where I spent all my time
> at the show and had none of the "Vegas experience," which was a great
> relief.
>
> I find not enjoyment in artificial environments, smoke filled casinos
> and desperate, ostrich feather clad dancers. Well maybe one or two
> ostrich feather clad dancers.
>
Being a 'techie', I really can enjoy Las Vegas for the fantastic fantasy
world they have created using highly technical methods. The light show
over the old 'strip' is worth a visit just by itself.

== 15 of 25 ==
Date: Mon, May 11 2009 12:48 am
From: Ron Hunter

tony cooper wrote:
> On Sun, 10 May 2009 22:32:08 +0100, Chris H <chris@phaedsys.org>
> wrote:
>
>> In message <5m4e05hidbh48eouvm8ldfetfhuho6ovre@4ax.com>, tony cooper
>> <tony_cooper213@earthlink.net> writes
>>> On Sun, 10 May 2009 08:55:57 +0200, Wolfgang Schwanke <see@sig.nature>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> tony cooper <tony_cooper213@earthlink.net> wrote in
>>>> news:246b051d42a3u96iv9e1akou2mn6a3qbja@4ax.com:
>>>>
>>>>> My wife and I have traveled to Europe, Africa, Central America, South
>>>>> America, and some of the Caribbean islands. One of my wife's brothers
>>>>> never traveled outside of Illinois in his life. He was an
>>>>> intelligent, successful, interesting person. He simply had no
>>>>> interest in travel.
>>>>>
>>>>> There are many Europeans exactly like my wife's brother. There are
>>>>> other Europeans who travel extensively.
>>>> But do those Europeans pretend that they can experience the same things
>>>> at home?
>>> I don't see any American pretending he can experience the same things
>>> at home.
>> Well yes... I saw a program about the casinos in Las Vegas and the
>> Americans were looking at the recreations of Venice and the Eiffel tower
>> etc and saying it's all here we don't need to go to Europe... but I hope
>> they are the exception
>
> Disneyland Europe, or whatever it is they call it, was built so
> Europeans wouldn't need to bother coming to the US.
>
>
That's as silly as saying a visit to Las Vegas is as good as a trip to
Europe. Just NOT SO!

== 16 of 25 ==
Date: Mon, May 11 2009 12:50 am
From: "Mike"

On Sun, 10 May 2009 03:21:00 -0500, Ron Hunter <rphunter@charter.net>
wrote:

>My brother used to
>tell a story of getting lost in a part of England where he could barely
>make out most of what people said. Cockney, I think he said it was.
>And the UK is VERY small, compared with the US.

but of course Europe isn't and drive for most of a day and you will
likely to have crossed a couple of legal systems and languages.
"cockney" was the old speech pattern of east London, it used to
include rhyming slang to confuse ("apples" for "stairs" from "apples
and pears", its still just about alive - "ruby" for curry from "ruby
Murray)
Glasgow is the place where even native English people cannot
understand the locals, 30 years ago the same applied to Cornwall.
--
Mike

== 17 of 25 ==
Date: Mon, May 11 2009 12:54 am
From: "Mike"

On Sun, 10 May 2009 10:49:36 +0200, Erick T. Barkhuis
<erick.use-net@ardane.c-o-m> wrote:

>In larger countries/states like the UK (compare Scottish with Cockney
>and with local dialect in Exeter)

and it extends to attitudes and food too, southern Spain is all
manana, flamenco and fish frying in oil (what many outsiders think of
as "spanish") the north is butter, bull running and the worlds best
food, the stern castilian centre is all roast meat, there are five
languages in the Iberian penninsula, you could drive to any of them
from Madrid on the same day. Thats not the same as having immigrants,
which everybody except Japan has.
--
Mike

== 18 of 25 ==
Date: Mon, May 11 2009 12:56 am
From: "Mike"

On Sun, 10 May 2009 17:41:01 +0100, "William Black"
<william.black@hotmail.co.uk> wrote:

>Interestingly, not in the North Yorkshire villages, where people can still
>tell, to an extent, where people are from.

its easy in Devon amd Cornwall, they will be from London or surrey.
--
Mike

== 19 of 25 ==
Date: Mon, May 11 2009 12:57 am
From: "Mike"

On Sun, 10 May 2009 17:50:34 +0100, Chris H <chris@phaedsys.org>
wrote:

>However due to Television regional accents are fading somewhat which is
>a shame.

I wish somebody would tell the lowland scots.
--
Mike

== 20 of 25 ==
Date: Mon, May 11 2009 1:00 am
From: "Mike"

On Sat, 09 May 2009 21:09:59 -0500, Doug McDonald
<mcdonald@NoSpAmscs.uiuc.edu> wrote:

> In some places owning handguns is (officially) prohibited, in some it is
>(officially, though not in practice) compulsory.

ahhh, Switzerland?

>And unless you have traveled widely in the USA, you would
>be surprised at how different the isolated cultures can be.
>We're all Americans i a big sense (even the illegal Mexicans ...
>why do you think they are here?), not Japanese,
>but the differences are very wide.

I'm sure there are loads of differences but I think you are fooling
yourself they are as great as the differences between a Frenchman, a
Brit and a spaniard, this sounds like the start of the many jokes
based on those very differences.
--
Mike

== 21 of 25 ==
Date: Mon, May 11 2009 1:01 am
From: "Mike"

On Sat, 9 May 2009 22:43:31 -0400, "J. Clarke"
<jclarke.usenet@cox.net> wrote:

>FWIW, it is no longer within the authority of the government in the US to
>prohibit ownership of handguns. The Supreme Court ruled on the DC handgun
>ban and the ruling was that it was an unlawful infringement on the Second
>Amendment. It helped that the judge in the apellate court that previously
>upheld the ban made a complete fool of himself in the ruling.

all Americans drone on about the constitution and guns and put flags
everywhere to remind them what country they are in.

game, set, match
--
Mike

== 22 of 25 ==
Date: Mon, May 11 2009 1:04 am
From: "Mike"

On Sat, 09 May 2009 08:16:47 -0500, Ron Hunter <rphunter@charter.net>
wrote:

>> as does from LOndon to Cornwall, however you get the real change by
>> croosing to other countries, everybody but amercians know this.
>
>With the European Union pretty well established, just what do you gain
>by cruising in Europe that you wouldn't see in the US?

the EU has almost no impact of national identities other than a common
currency in most of the countries

>I have seen
>greater differences traveling between some US states than between, say,
>Germany and Austria.

Germany and Austria are obviously your best argument, try Madrid,
Sevilla and Lisbon.
--
Mike

== 23 of 25 ==
Date: Mon, May 11 2009 1:04 am
From: "Mike"

On Sun, 10 May 2009 13:27:40 +0200, Wolfgang Schwanke <see@sig.nature>
wrote:

>The European Union is not a country, even though the common currency
>and the removal of border controls have admittedly muddied the water a
>bit.

no common currency here in UK!:-)
--
Mike

== 24 of 25 ==
Date: Mon, May 11 2009 1:06 am
From: "Mike"

On Sun, 10 May 2009 11:31:22 -0500, Ron Hunter <rphunter@charter.net>
wrote:

>Given all that
>international traffic, and a common currency, I suspect that in 20
>years, it will be much like traveling from one US state to another.

no, you cross the border, the language usually changes. Check out
French and British attitudes to food, 20 or so miles apart. Check out
British and northern Italain attiudes to food and dress (and to
sexism) or driving.
--
Mike

== 25 of 25 ==
Date: Mon, May 11 2009 1:08 am
From: "Mike"

On Sun, 10 May 2009 11:31:22 -0500, Ron Hunter <rphunter@charter.net>
wrote:

> I suspect that in 20
>years, it will be much like traveling from one US state to another.

what, the same restaurant and supernarket chains and beer brands? To
some extend that is happening, but only to some extend, spanish
fiestas only "work" in spain.
--
Mike

==============================================================================
TOPIC: May I know where to find these programs?
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.photo.digital/t/db6cd71e48b688fe?hl=en
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, May 11 2009 12:50 am
From: Ron Hunter

Voivod wrote:
> On Sun, 10 May 2009 11:54:49 -0400, Alan Browne
> <alan.browne@Freelunchvideotron.ca> scribbled:
>
>> philo wrote:
>>> "M-M" <nospam.m-m@ny.more> wrote in message
>>> news:nospam.m-m-7F4737.10352410052009@cpe-76-190-186-198.neo.res.rr.com...
>>>> In article
>>>> <41306507-48c7-4116-9044-9c6570944732@z23g2000prd.googlegroups.com>,
>>>> aicnevivnoc@gmail.com wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> As I understand it, every time we crop a picture, rotate it, or clean
>>>>> it, most graphic programs actually throw away a bit of the details. As
>>>>> the cropping, cleaning, resizing increases, more details are lost.
>>>> Save them as TIFF or Photoshop documents- anything but jpg.
>>>
>>> Correct.
>>>
>>> What I usually do is keep all my original jpg's
>>> convert all of them to tif
>>>
>>> then edit the tif
>>>
>>> A very good free program is GIMP
>> Yes indeed and you get what you pay for.
>
> You're an idiot.
>
>> A much better paid for program is PS Elements and PS CS3/4.
>
> A seriously fucking stupid idiot.
>
For the technical aspects they (GIMP and PS CS/4) are pretty much of
equal capability, but the price/performance issue gives GIMP a really
significant advantage.