Photoshop How To Use: rec.photo.digital - 25 new messages in 11 topics

rec.photo.digital
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.photo.digital?hl=en

rec.photo.digital@googlegroups.com

Today's topics:

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Could you actually see photos made from RAW files?
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.photo.digital/t/c04187075ef6f9c5?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 13 2009 2:58 pm
From: Paul Furman

aniramca@gmail.com wrote:
> ...
> My question is whether we can physically see a RAW file... I mean
> without placing it in the mercy of a software to open it as a JPEG

Really the only way to 'see' it is to process with a range of settings
to see the possibilities the raw file offers. You can make it viewable
but that's sort of meaningless, it's like tasting a whole spice cabinet,
everything dumped into one bowl versus possible recipies and the jpeg is
like what can you cook with a pantry containing a can of pre-made soup
plus various amounts of salt & pepper - you can't subtract garlic from that.

> file (and in the mean time, the software is doing the processing and
> converting it into JPEG using their own algorithm to produce what they
> consider to be the best JPEG. I agree that perhaps people should
> create both RAW and JPEG files when they take pictures.
>
> The next question is whether commercial photo processing softwares
> (Photoshop, Paintshop, Aperture, etc) treating RAW files produced from
> different brand cameras differently, as I noticed that the extension
> file name for RAW files differ from cameras to cameras. Can the
> special software made by the camera's manufacturer (which sometimes
> comes with the camera that you purchase) do a better job than the
> commercially photo processing softwares?

Camera manufacturer's software tends to do a little better but it tends
to be less usable software so if you appreciate smooth workflow, that's
a detriment. I wish they'd just share what's needed to get the best out
of their files rather than trying to get into the software business! I
refuse to pay them for awkward buggy software.

> I recall that someone mentioned that the camera's processing engine is
> not as versatile as a computer's photo processing software, as well as
> the time to produce the JPEG file in the camera is relatively short.
> Therefore, built-in camera processing engine cannot make a better job
> than a real photo processing software. As processing speed is getting
> faster and faster, could a camera sometime in the future produces JPEG
> photos which are as good as or better than the commercial photo
> softwares?

Sure.

--
Paul Furman
www.edgehill.net
www.baynatives.com

all google groups messages filtered due to spam

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 13 2009 4:12 pm
From: Paul Furman

bugbear wrote:
> Bob Larter wrote:
>> Pat wrote:
>>> I don't remember the exact title of the book, but Johnny Mnumatic also
>>> comes to mind -- about a guy transporting (too much) data in his brain.
>>
>> 'Johhny Mnemonic'
>>
>
> Thanks - I can never remember the title of that film.
>
> If only I could think of some trick that would help me.

'bonny moronic'

er... nevermind :-)

==============================================================================
TOPIC: The Shot Seen 'Round the World
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.photo.digital/t/15107f2ca666bb2e?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 13 2009 3:00 pm
From: "Peter"

"Chris H" <chris@phaedsys.org> wrote in message
news:wt6a9LBPj$MKFAX2@phaedsys.demon.co.uk...
> In message <dij735tmvt0gkja63of5pqmdi538udspbl@4ax.com>, tony cooper
> <tony_cooper213@earthlink.net> writes
>>On Sat, 13 Jun 2009 15:55:33 +0100, Chris H <chris@phaedsys.org>
>>wrote:
>>
>>>In message <250106fb-48d5-4568-9929-b61247c183be@y7g2000yqa.googlegroups
>>>.com>, Rich <rander3127@gmail.com> writes
>>>>On Jun 10, 9:02 pm, ASAAR <cau...@22.com> wrote:
>>>>> http://online.wsj.com/article/SB124424737510590641.html?mod=googlenew...
>>>>>
>>>>> Finally, and none too soon!
>>>>
>>>>Baseball?
>>>
>>>Otherwise known as the girl's game of Rounders in the civilised world.
>>
>>Not just in the civilized world. I think the game is called
>>"rounders" in the UK, too.
>
> :-)
>
>>
>>>Baseball, American Football and the like are relay only of interest in
>>>the USA. So *any* event in Baseball only has local interest.
>>
>>You've not heard of Japan?
>
> OK so 2 countries..
>

Don't be so insular.

Add most of East Asia, many countries in Latin America, oh! yes, The Czech
Republic, etc

--
Peter

== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 13 2009 3:04 pm
From: "Peter"

"tony cooper" <tony_cooper213@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:gv48359748hbdlkbiuroim7k4vkgjrc5kv@4ax.com...
> On Sat, 13 Jun 2009 16:24:53 -0400, "J. Clarke"
> <jclarke.usenet@cox.net> wrote:
>
>>Chris H wrote:
>>> In message <dij735tmvt0gkja63of5pqmdi538udspbl@4ax.com>, tony cooper
>>> <tony_cooper213@earthlink.net> writes
>>>> On Sat, 13 Jun 2009 15:55:33 +0100, Chris H <chris@phaedsys.org>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> In message
>>>>> <250106fb-48d5-4568-9929-b61247c183be@y7g2000yqa.googlegroups
>>>>> .com>, Rich <rander3127@gmail.com> writes
>>>>>> On Jun 10, 9:02 pm, ASAAR <cau...@22.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> http://online.wsj.com/article/SB124424737510590641.html?mod=googlenew...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Finally, and none too soon!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Baseball?
>>>>>
>>>>> Otherwise known as the girl's game of Rounders in the civilised
>>>>> world.
>>>>
>>>> Not just in the civilized world. I think the game is called
>>>> "rounders" in the UK, too.
>>>
>>> :-)
>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Baseball, American Football and the like are relay only of
>>>>> interest in the USA. So *any* event in Baseball only has local
>>>>> interest.
>>>>
>>>> You've not heard of Japan?
>>>
>>> OK so 2 countries..
>>
>>Guess you haven't heard of Cuba either. Commies they may be, but they
>>love
>>"beisbol".
>>
>>>>> The problem is that Americans think that things that are important
>>>>> only to Americans are of global significance.
>
> Chris is doing exactly what he accuses Americans of doing, but in
> reverse. He accuses Americans of being interested only what is done
> in America as a Brit who is not interested in anything that is not
> done in the UK.
>
> That's OK, though. We Americans are not interested in the shove
> ha'penny finals, the Aunt Sally cup matches, or the conkers death
> matches and we don't feel the least bit arrogant about it.

But, many of us used to be very interested in the Irish Sweepstakes.

>
> The British media have other priorities. BBC feels that women with
> large breasts are far more deserving of coverage than a baseball game.
> http://www.hiddenfeet.com/my-big-breasts-and-me-bbc-documentary/
>

Over a mouthful is wasted.

--
Peter

== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 13 2009 3:17 pm
From: Paul Furman

ASAAR wrote:
> On Thu, 11 Jun 2009 15:11:20 +1000, "Paul Bartram" <paul.bartram AT
> OR NEAR lizzy.com.au> wrote:
>
>>> Finally, and none too soon!
>> I have to say, I've never seen that photo before, nor can I see what is
>> special about it, not being a baseball fan. As a photograph, it looks like
>> any one of millions of 'point & shoot' shots taken from the stands at any
>> sports event over the years. I'm sure it is historical with regards to the
>> sport, but to me... nehh.
>
> You have to realize that the image quality on that web page is
> quite poor.

800x652 pixel version:
http://theonlinephotographer.typepad.com/.a/6a00df351e888f8834011570e4466f970b-popup
from:
http://theonlinephotographer.typepad.com/the_online_photographer/2009/06/rudy-mancuso-gets-justice-in-the-end.html

> The Busch Pressman was a medium format camera and...

--
Paul Furman
www.edgehill.net
www.baynatives.com

all google groups messages filtered due to spam

== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 13 2009 4:06 pm
From: John McWilliams

Chris H wrote:

> Baseball, American Football and the like are relay only of interest in
> the USA. So *any* event in Baseball only has local interest.

In general, true, but there are exceptions. What else consititutes "the
like"?

> The problem is that Americans think that things that are important only
> to Americans are of global significance.

Some Americans think this, just as some Brits, Aussies, French, German
etc etc etc. are chauvinistic and/or narrowminded and/or boorish clods
and/or misanthropic twits.

You consistently engage in bashing others, and with a broad brush. Could
you rethink this?

--
john mcwilliams

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Correct name for "pinhole lens" used in covert cameras?
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.photo.digital/t/4a3f36ff97395b3f?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 13 2009 3:25 pm
From: daveFaktor

Alison J wrote:
> Can I ask you specialists some questions about digital cameras.
>
> I want some info on the optical quality of the lenses used in small
> digital camera units lie this: http://tr.im/onwK.
>
> Many sites call that a "pinhole lens" but when I search for
> "pinhole lens" I get hits for lenses created by making a pinhole in
> a card.
>
> Is this tiny glass or plastic lens more correctly called by some
> other term which I can use for a search?
>
> Thank you.
> AJ
>
> PS---I would appreciate any links to info on the typical optical
> quality and specification of these lenses. (Usual angle of view,
> typical low light sensitivity, depth of focus, etc.) I can guess
> these are probably low spec but how low?

The camera is known as : "Camera Obscura" Not sure it that's spelt
correctly but it sound right.

== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 13 2009 5:48 pm
From: PatM

On Jun 13, 10:27 am, Alison J <nom...@mail.com> wrote:
> Can I ask you specialists some questions about digital cameras.
>
> I want some info on the optical quality of the lenses used in small
> digital camera units lie this: http://tr.im/onwK.
>
> Many sites call that a "pinhole lens" but when I search for
> "pinhole lens" I get hits for lenses created by making a pinhole in
> a card.
>
> Is this tiny glass or plastic lens more correctly called by some
> other term which I can use for a search?
>
> Thank you.
> AJ
>
> PS---I would appreciate any links to info on the typical optical
> quality and specification of these lenses. (Usual angle of view,
> typical low light sensitivity, depth of focus, etc.) I can guess
> these are probably low spec but how low?

You are hurting my brain, but IIRC that type of lens is called a
"Pancake Lens".

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 13 2009 5:57 pm
From: Matt Ion

daveFaktor wrote:
> Alison J wrote:
>> Can I ask you specialists some questions about digital cameras.
>>
>> I want some info on the optical quality of the lenses used in small
>> digital camera units lie this: http://tr.im/onwK.
>>
>> Many sites call that a "pinhole lens" but when I search for "pinhole
>> lens" I get hits for lenses created by making a pinhole in a card.
>>
>> Is this tiny glass or plastic lens more correctly called by some other
>> term which I can use for a search?
>>
>> Thank you.
>> AJ
>>
>> PS---I would appreciate any links to info on the typical optical
>> quality and specification of these lenses. (Usual angle of view,
>> typical low light sensitivity, depth of focus, etc.) I can guess
>> these are probably low spec but how low?
>
> The camera is known as : "Camera Obscura" Not sure it that's spelt
> correctly but it sound right.

That is spelled correctly, but that's not what he's talking about.
That's what his searches keep finding, it's not what he's looking for.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: How to hold and carry a camera with a heavy lens
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.photo.digital/t/35d5d71e3cce87b4?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 13 2009 3:54 pm
From: "Robert"

Yes!
<aniramca@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:a56d2525-f102-42b9-be21-e333df6147ea@q14g2000vbn.googlegroups.com...
>I am wondering what is the best way to carry around a camera in a hand
> strap with heavy and large lenses (glass lenses 200-300mm up)
> I felt uncomfortable to let the camera with a heavy lens hang on its
> strap while walking around. Do most people handle the lens just at the
> lens mount area to support the camera and lens while walking? If you
> just let it hangs on the strap, the strap can also break. Was it just
> recently a major camera brand name provided a notice about their
> defective camera hand strap?
> Another related question is whether there are any cases that with a
> lot of usage, the camera-lens mount buckle/bend under the pressures?
> I assume that most DSLR bodies are made of steel around the lens
> mount. Are cheaper DSLRs (non pro type) more prone to this failure, as
> perhaps the lens mount on the camera body was not designed to carry
> for heavy lenses? Or is the camera body usually over-designed and this
> would never be a problem at all.
> Thanks for info and discussion.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Canon Reliability
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.photo.digital/t/744b5f8d8994cb7d?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 13 2009 4:00 pm
From: SMS

Ray Fischer wrote:

> Wrong and wrong. The survey doesn't ask people to report if their
> camera broke, and the survey is representative. CR knows the math of
> statistical sampling. You do not.

LOL, the statistical sampling math isn't all that hard yet Navas always
gets his panties in a bunch when the survey results for a particular
product or service don't align with what he's purchased. This goes _way_
back.

Here's one easy to use calculator for sampling sizes and margins of
error if Navas wants to begin educating himself:
"http://www.surveysystem.com/sscalc.htm"

The complaints about Consumer Reports are rarely about the sample size,
they're that the respondents are all Consumer Reports subscribers that
choose to respond rather than the survey being double-blind. So if you
believe that a large number of CR subscribers are a) not representative
of the general population when it comes to their usage of the product or
service, _and_ b) are more likely to lie about one product or service
versus a competing product or service, then the complaints would have
some validity, but of course no one has ever For example, CR does a
very large survey each year on cellular providers with a statistical
sample so large that the margin of error is extremely small. Navas hates
that survey because his carrier, AT&T (Cingular) always does very
poorly, so he makes up stories about problems with the survey. Yet the
survey isn't asking subscribers "which is the best carrier" it's simply
asking them a series of questions of their experiences with their own
carrier.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Pinhole camera
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.photo.digital/t/b220f8a078b140c9?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 13 2009 4:11 pm
From: Nicko

YDOD wrote:
> Perhaps the name you are thinking of is "camera obscura"

Perhaps not.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: grim news for photographers tourism and rights
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.photo.digital/t/f739094ebddaa70e?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 7 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 13 2009 4:23 pm
From: Paul Furman

tony cooper wrote:
> The Becker incident

What's that?

== 2 of 7 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 13 2009 4:35 pm
From: nospam

In article <9yWYl.13220$im1.12307@nlpi061.nbdc.sbc.com>, Paul Furman
<paul-@-edgehill.net> wrote:

> tony cooper wrote:
> > The Becker incident
>
> What's that?

shane becker who recently took a photo of an atm in seattle and was
subsequently falsely arrested for asserting his constitutional rights.

== 3 of 7 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 13 2009 5:10 pm
From: tony cooper

On Sat, 13 Jun 2009 19:35:31 -0400, nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid>
wrote:

>In article <9yWYl.13220$im1.12307@nlpi061.nbdc.sbc.com>, Paul Furman
><paul-@-edgehill.net> wrote:
>
>> tony cooper wrote:
>> > The Becker incident
>>
>> What's that?
>
>shane becker who recently took a photo of an atm in seattle and was
>subsequently falsely arrested for asserting his constitutional rights.

Or, a guy who thought it his day was better spent in jail rather than
produce an ID, depending on your point of view. Actually, from
Becker's point of view, things turned out well. He got his five
minutes of fame on the news and on interview shows, he got to promote
his tee shirts, and something finally happened to him where someone
paid attention to him.

--
Tony Cooper - Orlando, Florida

== 4 of 7 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 13 2009 5:14 pm
From: nospam

In article <fje835dv44gsc4pt8iohogutcns5v4k7r3@4ax.com>, tony cooper
<tony_cooper213@earthlink.net> wrote:

> >> > The Becker incident
> >>
> >> What's that?
> >
> >shane becker who recently took a photo of an atm in seattle and was
> >subsequently falsely arrested for asserting his constitutional rights.
>
> Or, a guy who thought it his day was better spent in jail rather than
> produce an ID, depending on your point of view.

we went over this already. refusing to provide an id is *not* an
arrestible offense in washington state. period.

== 5 of 7 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 13 2009 5:58 pm
From: tony cooper

On Sat, 13 Jun 2009 20:14:21 -0400, nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid>
wrote:

>In article <fje835dv44gsc4pt8iohogutcns5v4k7r3@4ax.com>, tony cooper
><tony_cooper213@earthlink.net> wrote:
>
>> >> > The Becker incident
>> >>
>> >> What's that?
>> >
>> >shane becker who recently took a photo of an atm in seattle and was
>> >subsequently falsely arrested for asserting his constitutional rights.
>>
>> Or, a guy who thought it his day was better spent in jail rather than
>> produce an ID, depending on your point of view.
>
>we went over this already. refusing to provide an id is *not* an
>arrestible offense in washington state. period.

I don't care what we went over, and I didn't say if the arrest was
justified or not. I think the guy was a stubborn idiot and brought an
avoidable problem on himself.

If someone wants to take a stance to make a point about something they
believe in, that's commendable. But do it over something important.
If all they want is blog-fodder and a chance to appear on local
television, screw 'em.

Becker's website has been updated. He's now bragging about how big
iTunes library is: "If you're in Portland, @ me and we can hang out.
1 hour ago # Oh man, I just re-found Tsunami Bomb. I used to listen to
this record tons in Salt Lake City. 3 hours ago # Somehow my iTunes
library is 103 GB. Giga wha? Giga who. I'm trimming it down. My goal
is under 50 jiggabytes. 5 hours ago # If you didn't know and do care,
facebook lets you set a user name now."

This is not the profile of a patriot or a defender of Constitutional
rights. It's the profile of someone who will go down in history as
"Shane who?". Pick better heroes, "nospam".

Does my attitude bother you? Do you think it bothers me that it does?

--
Tony Cooper - Orlando, Florida

== 6 of 7 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 13 2009 6:18 pm
From: rfischer@sonic.net (Ray Fischer)

tony cooper <tony_cooper213@earthlink.net> wrote:
>On Sat, 13 Jun 2009 20:14:21 -0400, nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid>
>wrote:
>
>>In article <fje835dv44gsc4pt8iohogutcns5v4k7r3@4ax.com>, tony cooper
>><tony_cooper213@earthlink.net> wrote:
>>
>>> >> > The Becker incident
>>> >>
>>> >> What's that?
>>> >
>>> >shane becker who recently took a photo of an atm in seattle and was
>>> >subsequently falsely arrested for asserting his constitutional rights.
>>>
>>> Or, a guy who thought it his day was better spent in jail rather than
>>> produce an ID, depending on your point of view.
>>
>>we went over this already. refusing to provide an id is *not* an
>>arrestible offense in washington state. period.
>
>I don't care what we went over, and I didn't say if the arrest was
>justified or not. I think the guy was a stubborn idiot and brought an
>avoidable problem on himself.

We should put up with ignorant thugs rather than educate them and
punish those who are lawbreakers?

>If someone wants to take a stance to make a point about something they
>believe in, that's commendable. But do it over something important.

Like illegal detention? Harassment from law enforcement?

--
Ray Fischer
rfischer@sonic.net

== 7 of 7 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 13 2009 6:21 pm
From: nospam

In article <4oh8351bgnp0ars2iiol3qirjt52m15npf@4ax.com>, tony cooper
<tony_cooper213@earthlink.net> wrote:

> I don't care what we went over, and I didn't say if the arrest was
> justified or not. I think the guy was a stubborn idiot and brought an
> avoidable problem on himself.

stubborn idiots have constitutional rights too. as i said previously,
he did nothing wrong and the entire episode was the fault of the guards
and the police who apparently lack a basic understanding of the laws in
washington state.

once again, he *can't* be legally arrested for refusing to provide id.
period.

> If someone wants to take a stance to make a point about something they
> believe in, that's commendable. But do it over something important.
> If all they want is blog-fodder and a chance to appear on local
> television, screw 'em.

do you really think he planned to market t-shirts by setting out to
shop at rei, then take a photo of an atm and subsequently getting
arrested?? that's crazy.

> Becker's website has been updated. He's now bragging about how big
> iTunes library is: "If you're in Portland, @ me and we can hang out.
> 1 hour ago # Oh man, I just re-found Tsunami Bomb. I used to listen to
> this record tons in Salt Lake City. 3 hours ago # Somehow my iTunes
> library is 103 GB. Giga wha? Giga who. I'm trimming it down. My goal
> is under 50 jiggabytes. 5 hours ago # If you didn't know and do care,
> facebook lets you set a user name now."

what does that have to do with anything?

> This is not the profile of a patriot or a defender of Constitutional
> rights. It's the profile of someone who will go down in history as
> "Shane who?". Pick better heroes, "nospam".

what's the profile of a patriot or a defender of constitutional rights?
is there something about that which precludes having large itunes
libraries?

> Does my attitude bother you? Do you think it bothers me that it does?

what bothers me is your lack of understanding of constitutional rights.
unfortunately, there are many who don't understand them, particularly
those in positions of power and who should know better.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Kalmar Nyckel and Ameriscan Goldfinch
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.photo.digital/t/6041742ab690e5f9?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 13 2009 4:44 pm
From: Paul Furman

me@mine.net wrote:
> My favorite shots from this morning of the replica tall ship Karmar Nyckel
> docked in Yorktown, VA this weekend and American Goldfinch feeding just up
> the road from Surrender Field where the British surrendered at the end of
> the American Revolutionary War.
>...
> If you care to sort through all the thumbnails or run the slideshow:
> http://edwardgruf.com/2009-06-13_am/

Beautiful, thanks for sharing.

--
Paul Furman
www.edgehill.net
www.baynatives.com

all google groups messages filtered due to spam

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Slide to digital conversion
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.photo.digital/t/c66961e95e8dbb51?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 13 2009 6:15 pm
From: Keith Nuttle

I saw this advertised on the web.

Iona Sliders And Negative Converter
"Iona Sliders And Negative Cnvrtr To PC OR iPod NIC
35mm Photo Negative and Slide Converter to PCTranfers 35mm negatives and
slides to PC or notebook quickly and easilyTurntable has 2 ports for
converting nearly simultaneously from record, through computer, into any
iPod?Print, edit or archive photo collection with quick and easy
scanning software5MP hi-res full-color scanning with 1-touch instant
scanUSB 2.0 connection and USB 2.0 portFixed focus range and auto
exposure/color balance with high-quality 4 glass optical elementIncludes
USB connection and software "

and was attracted by the price.

Has anyone had any experience with this or similar type of slide to
digital system?

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 13 2009 6:23 pm
From: nospam

In article <h11j0m$bkh$1@aioe.org>, Keith Nuttle
<keith_nuttle@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

> Has anyone had any experience with this or similar type of slide to
> digital system?

you get what you pay for. the results are probably ok for web pages
but that's about it.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: A newbie request help selecting digital camera
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.photo.digital/t/4222610fecc12359?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 13 2009 6:20 pm
From: rwalker

On Sat, 13 Jun 2009 01:03:52 -0500, Educating the Idiots <eti@eti.net>
wrote:

snip

>>
>>Gee, so the P&S troll was talking through his arse again? What a surprise.
>
>
>Dear Resident-Troll,
>
> Your reply is completely off-topic.

Bow wow, woof woof. Roll over and play dead, idiot.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: wear from 1/4 Whitworth versus 1/4 UNC
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.photo.digital/t/c88b466b5bf2732c?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 13 2009 6:59 pm
From: Rob Morley

On Sat, 13 Jun 2009 11:44:47 -0700
Jürgen Exner <jurgenex@hotmail.com> wrote:

> "michael adams" <mjadams25@onetel.net.uk> wrote:
> >Although admittedly as the bolt is being threaded one thread at a
> >time rather than all at once
>
> This is way off-topic, but on a side note:
>
> There is only one thread on a bolt (well, there are some speciality
> bolt which have two threads).
>
> And the thread on mass-market bolts is not cut with a lathe or die one
> revolution at a time but formed in one step by rolling, see
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taps_and_dies#Rolled_and_formed_threads
>
Rolled threads are still formed "one revolution at a time", it's just
that the material is pushed out of the way rather than being cut like
a regular lathe tool or cutting die does, so there is no swarf to worry
about (and a rolled thread has better characteristics). A thread
rolling head is just like a thread cutting head, except it has hardened
ridged rollers rather than hardened ridged cutting edges. :-)
It's often quite easy to spot the difference between a rolled and a cut
thread - the outside diameter of a rolled thread is slightly larger
than the stock from which it has been formed.

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Sat, Jun 13 2009 7:11 pm
From: Rob Morley

On Sat, 13 Jun 2009 19:09:30 +0100
"michael adams" <mjadams25@onetel.net.uk> wrote:
>
> "Rob Morley" <nospam@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
> news:20090613181319.2183229c@bluemoon...

> > I don't think you understand the difference between thread pitch and
> > thread angle.
>
> The thread angle is the angle of the sides of each thread against the
> centre line of the bolt. As in the angles of a pyramid etc. The pitch
> is the number of threads per inch or cm.

The angles of a pyramid as seen from where - plan, elevation, normal to
a face?
>
> Although admittedly as the bolt is being threaded one thread at a time
> rather than all at once the disparity doesn't increase as stated
> above. I don't know where that came from.

That was the bit that particularly confused me.
>
> Mixing threads may be OK for a one-off lash-up, but not where a
> camera may be subsequently used on a standard Whitworth tripod head.
>
It depends on the sort of damage (if any) that might be caused. A
plastic thread may be worn or broken, an aluminium thread may be
deformed, and any of these may be a show stopper or negligible depending
on degree.

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